H. E. Double Toothpicks.
March 22, 2010
Maybe I should ease into this post by doing my usual schtick of rambling around the edges before getting to the point, and there are times, believe it or not, when opinionated and straightforward me taps lightly around my beliefs because I know for those located in, or coming from, a conservative Christian tradition as I did, it can feel unsettling when people you connect with on other levels seem to be walking dangerously close to the ledge in others. All I can tell is ledge walking might not be the safest place but once you’ve seen the horizon from that viewpoint there’s no going back.
Though at first glance it might seem so, a post on hell isn’t so far off-topic for SisterFriends, not as long as there are GLBTQ Christians in the process of reconciling their faith and sexuality who continue to wonder “Will I go to hell because I’m gay?” Normally when someone poses this question in an email I avoid the topic of hell altogether realizing that the belief in hell and in retribution theology (punishment for bad, reward for good) runs deep through many raised in conservative Christianity. Instead I tend to address the fear that underlays such questioning and center my response on those passages that dispel the idea that God would ever be at the heart of such anguished fear.
For God has not given us a spirit of fear, but of power and of love and of a sound mind. — 2 Timothy 1: 7
Peace I leave with you, My peace I give to you; not as the world gives do I give to you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid. — John 14: 27
There is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear because fear involves torment. But he who fears has not been made perfect in love. — 1 John 4: 18
But as long as people believe there’s a chance at the end of their lives that they will have messed things up so bad or fallen so short of where God would have them to be that they risk damnation there will always be fear and so it seemed as good a time as any to expose the ledge I’m standing on and to give a more complete and honest response to the question for the next one who would ask it of me.
So here we go.
I’m not about to say that hell doesn’t exist, neither am I saying I believe it does. The fact is that hell, as a locale, can no more be denied than it can be proven since despite all the theological arguments made for or against such a place, certitude on the matter is outside the grasp of all of us until the moment of our death. Until then all we can do is abandon ourselves to our faith and in what we believe…whether it’s traditional church teaching on the matter or personal belief.
There were far too many years when I believed that while God loved me God could and would condemn me to hell if I had sinned too much or strayed too far outside God’s will. Should I die “in sin” my parting glimpse of God wouldn’t be of his love but of his wrath, but fortunately, as it happened, I believed the right truth and was living the right life (Self-Righteous, party of one, your table is waiting!) so I didn’t fear hell but looked ahead confidently to heaven.
But in recent years I’ve had a change of heart and mind and I no longer believe God would or will ever condemn anyone to a permanent state of punishment and torment. The change has come about not because I’ve spent years locked in academic research and study on the Christian doctrine of hell. The change has come simply, though not easily, through my changing understanding and experiences with the love of God. I’ve reflected on what it really means when we say the love of God is unconditional and infinite, and that God is the giver of undeserved mercy and extravagant grace. After 53 years of being in love with God I’m only now beginning to understand what it means when we declare with assurance that “nothing will ever separate us from the love of God.”
I don’t believe in eternal punishment because I believe in the unconditional, infinite love of God.
Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil, but rejoices in the truth. It always protects, always hopes, always perseveres. Love never fails (I Corinthians 13:4-8).
At this point in my faith journey, to believe in the unconditional eternal love of God and to believe in eternal punishment as the will of God is, in my opinion, irrational. It simply makes no sense to propose that these two teachings stand harmoniously beside one another when the truth is that no two beliefs could be more oppositional to one another than these. I’m all for a God who works in mysteriously ways but I reject the idea of a God who acts irrationally and contradictory to his own nature. God may be full of surprises but when it comes to His steadfast love and unwavering grace, God is more predictable than that the earth will keep spinning.
I’m baffled that we’ve somehow managed to justify in Christian theology a Heavenly Father/Mother/Parent who behaves in a way that would appall us were we to witness the same behavior in an earthly parent directed toward their child and I said as much in my last post. God’s love is unconditional, immeasurable, limitless and forever. God loves you. God loves me. God loves them. For that reason if so much as one single person in all God’s creation falls outside the covering of God’s love, even the most vile and depraved among us, then God’s love is diminished for all, even for the most righteous and pure among us.
I don’t believe in eternal punishment because I believe that the perfect will and desire of God will be fulfilled.
In other words I believe God will ultimately get what God wants, and what God wants is that through Jesus He would be able to “reconcile to Himself all things” (Colossians 1:19-20); what God desires is that “all will be saved and come to the knowledge of truth” (I Timothy 2:3-4); what God wills is to bring “all things in heaven and earth together under one head, even Christ” (Ephesians 1:9-10), and what God does not want is that “any should perish but that everyone would come to repentance” (2 Peter 2:9). God wants, desires, and wills that all would be brought back to him and so the question is whether God will get what God wills or if for all eternity God’s will be left unfulfilled. If God wills that all would be returned onto him then it is impossible that even one person will be cast out of God’s presence. Even one soul separated from God would leave God discontent, like the Good Shepherd who wouldn’t rest until his entire flock was restored (Matthew 18:10-14) and like the poor woman who wouldn’t stop searching until she found her lost coin. (Luke 15:8-10). Neither the good shepherd or the poor woman were able or willing to celebrate until all that had been lost were found. And so it is with God. God is not willing that any would be lost and so, if we believe the perfect will of God will be fulfilled then we also believe that all will be found.
I don’t believe in eternal punishment because I believe Jesus is the Son of God and Savior of the World.
Jesus was God revealed in human flesh. In his life and his words Jesus was the greatest manifestation of God’s love that we have ever witnessed and there’s nothing I can see in the witness of his life or in the content of his teaching that would lead me to accept that Jesus’ ultimate purpose was to be the determining factor in who would go to heaven and who would be cast into hell based on individual acceptance or rejection of his identity. Instead I believe that the love, forgiveness, compassion, and full welcome Jesus showered on everyone he encountered will be the very love, forgiveness, compassion, and welcome that God extends to all.
I also believe that had Jesus not come, had he not preached and lived out the Good News of the Gospel, had he not died on the cross and been brought forth into newness of life, this world would be different in a way we can’t begin to imagine, for in Jesus’ life, death, and resurrection salvation came into the world and through him the world was saved. “I did not come to judge the world, but to save it” (John 12:47) and that’s what Jesus did. Through Jesus the world and all of creation was redeemed by the glory of God that spilled upon the earth through the work of Christ and salvation was given to all.
All have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came through Christ Jesus. (Romans 3:23).
God has bound all men over to disobedience so that he may have mercy on all men (Romans 11:32).
For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive (I Corinthians 15:22).
We put our hope in a living God, who is the Savior of all men, and especially of those who believe (I Timothy 4:9-10).
I know what I believe on paper echoes a theology of universal salvation but for me it’s not about labeling my beliefs or aligning them with what others profes. I only know that I can’t reconcile the idea that some will go to heaven and some will go to hell when I keep bumping into “all” and “every” in the Scriptures. Receiving the grace of God isn’t dependent on whether I believe the right things, attend the right church, pray the right prayers, or do the right things. Grace doesn’t depend on me being right. As Philip Gulley said in “If Grace Is True” grace is a gift, not a trophy. Grace gives no thought to whether I’m Protestant or Jewish or Agnostic. Grace isn’t determined by my sexual orientation. Grace depends fully on God. The grace I’ve been given. The grace you’ve been given. The grace they’ve been given. We’re all under God’s grace because the love of God would have it no other way.
Of course, coming to this place has meant I’ve done a whole lot of soul-searching and spiritual reflection on a wider circle of Christian doctrines. Redemption, salvation, the cross, sin, and atonement are all concepts of the Christian faith (my faith) that I continue to grapple with as my understanding of God’s love and grace for all evolves. But given my upbringing within a conservative Christian tradition do you know what the hardest part has been for me in moving from hell for some to hell for none?
It was overcoming my need for eternal punishment to exist.
The more I found my theology defaulting to the love and grace of God, the more troubled I was that there was a chance that those I thought deserved an eternity in hell for all the hurt they had brought into the world, the more I had to deal with the possibility that in eternity they’d be standing in the same brilliant light of God’s glory as would I. As a human being, I have an innate need for good to be rewarded and evil to be punished. I want those who have damaged or taken the lives of others to be held accountable and made to pay for it, whether the life of one child was harmed or it was the murder of six million. This is why I haven’t fully given up the idea that hell exists since a consequence for wrongdoing doesn’t seem completely contradictory to a God of grace; not if the punishment leads in time to them being restored to wholeness and reconciled back into the presence of God. Even though in my flesh I want those who cause suffering to suffer, given what I know to be true about the grace of God that’s been extended to me, I’m working to come to terms with the idea that even the most vile and depraved along with the most righteous and pure will all return to God. Shoulder to shoulder we will stand. Equal. Made clean.
So this is my excessively long answer to “Will I go to hell because I’m gay?”
No. You won’t go to hell for being gay because being gay isn’t a sin.
No. You won’t got to hell because God’s love and grace would never allow it. God’s love will never fail you even when you wonder if you’ve failed God.
And for any who need this disclaimer I want you to understand that what I’ve written here is what I believe, not what I think you should believe. I’m just one Christian expressing my beliefs and in stating them I’m not saying this is the only way to believe. I’m only being honest to what rings most true for me as I continue to work out my own faith which in the end rests firmly in Christ and in the God who sent Him.
Posted in Love and Grace, Periodic Reflections on the Love of God
Sweet Hope Cookies
March 22nd, 2010 at 3:35 pm
Hi Anita. I appreciate this. I’ve also come around to this thinking, much to my surprise. Have you read “If God is Love.” (I think that’s the title). It helped change my thinking. It was a huge revelation to me to realize that I too “needed” the concept of hell – both so bad people could be punished and so I could be superior to others. I’ve let that go and am better for it.
March 22nd, 2010 at 5:15 pm
I’m still not sure what I believe – certainly don’t want people to be punished and myself rewarded but I realize that some people would be mortified to think they go to ‘heaven’ with this God whether they want to or not. Isn’t their such a thing as an intentional rejection of Christ? Still working through this, but am convinced that if there is a literal hell you can’t slip up and fall in by accident
. I really appreciate your thoughts on this Anita – thank-you.
March 22nd, 2010 at 7:51 pm
I’ve wrestled with this very issue for all too long. Only recently have I begun to see as you do…that the mistake we’ve made is in limiting God’s grace to only being able to save very few. That doesn’t sound like “Mighty to Save” to me, it sounds like Jesus’ atoning work was rather useless in the grand scheme of things. Rather, I am growing in my understanding that my focus upon the everlasting Grace of God is allowing me to see a world desperate not for more hellfire and brimstone, but for more of His grace, more of His love, not less.
What a fantastic way of putting this. You’ve truly allowed me to congeal my own thoughts into something more palatable for my limited mind. Surely the “good news” has always been about His Greater Grace!
March 22nd, 2010 at 9:19 pm
I have to say I love this! I read this because Lori mentioned it, and I usually find my way to stuff that she thinks notable. This is brilliant. I love it, and you for writing it. In my tormented years before I came to light, I struggled with thus, and the inherent contradictions in the many messages I’ve been exposed to during my search. In the end I came to the same conclusions, and it so lights my life up finding more people coming to the same conclusion. Not for the novelty of knowing I’m right, but for the joy of seeing other hearts, minds and souls touched with love and light!
This is a wonderful post, thank you!
March 23rd, 2010 at 6:40 am
I too am here because of Lori’s comment. In the years of coming to terms with my Spiritual Journey through the Episcopal Church and how I have reconciled by my trans-ness and my faith, my beliefs have changed and grown.
I know that Satan is working against God’s love, not whether or not the early Apostles preached on Heaven or Hell is questionable. I read that it was the Fathers’ of the Catholic Church who created the names of Heaven and Hell to frighten and control the peasants and poor to bend to the will of the Church. To pass judgment on those who did not conform to the Church’s rules and was used as an excuse to punish, to create anarchy by using power and force to keep the uneducated under the thumb of the Church.
I too believe in a loving accepting ‘God’ who does not exclude anyone who knows his way.
March 23rd, 2010 at 10:05 am
You’ve made a number of excellent points to show there is no Hell.
I’ve actually written an entire book on this topic–Hell? No! Why You Can Be Certain There’s No Such Place As Hell, (for anyone interested, you can get a free ecopy of Did Jesus Believe in Hell?, one of the most compelling chapters in my book at http://www.thereisnohell.com), but if I may, I’d just like to add one more point from my book in support of your position.
If one is willing to look, there’s substantial evidence contained in the gospels to show that Jesus opposed the idea of Hell. For example, in Luke 9:51-56, is a story about his great disappointment with his disciples when they actually suggested imploring God to rain FIRE on a village just because they had rejected him. His response: “You don’t know what spirit is inspiring this kind of talk!” Presumably, it was NOT the Holy Spirit. He went on, trying to explain how he had come to save, heal and relieve suffering, not be the CAUSE of it.
So it only stands to reason that this same Jesus, who was appalled at the very idea of burning a few people, for a few horrific minutes until they were dead, could never, ever burn BILLIONS of people for an ETERNITY!
True, there are a few statements that made their way into the copies of copies of copies of the gospel texts which place “Hell” on Jesus’ lips, but these adulterations came along many decades after his death, most likely due to the Church filling up with Greeks who imported their belief in Hades with them when they converted.
Bear in mind that the historical Protestant doctrine of the inspiration of the Scriptures applies only to the original autographs, not the copies. But sadly, the interpolations that made their way into those copies have provided a convenient excuse for a lot of people to get around following Jesus’ real message.
March 23rd, 2010 at 2:18 pm
Shar–> Interesting thoughts Shar, and sure I think people can and do with intention reject Christ for a number of reasons (whether because of their faith as it is with the Jews or because of their disbelief as it is with atheists) but I don’t believe that the human heart that rejects Christ will be rejected and from the heart of God.
Laura –> I know. I was surprised to find myself going in this direction as well but now that I’m here I can’t begin to conceive of it being another way. As to the book, the one that speaks to hell and heaven is “If Grace is True.” “If Love is True” focuses more on our actions in the world as people committed to living the Gospel message. Both are excellent books and “If Grace Is True” didn’t begin my questioning but it certainly fueled and gave direction for it.
March 23rd, 2010 at 2:25 pm
Lori –> What you said rings true for me as well. Echoing your comment that “it sounds like Jesus’ atoning work was rather useless in the grand scheme of things” is powerful, but yes, if only a portion of humanity is ultimately received by God then it would suggest that the God becoming flesh and the work of the cross and the resurrection that followed had a minimal effect. I believe the work of the cross was complete and that when Jesus said “It is finished” it wasn’t finished half-way. Lori, as you said, this world doesn’t need more hellfire and brimstone. We know plenty of people who are already living through agonizing variations of “hell on earth” already. It is the grace of God that will woo them, not threats of more of the same…and if you and I know that, certainly God does too.
March 23rd, 2010 at 2:30 pm
Aw Samantha, so glad you stopped by and thank you for contributing a comment. With so many coming to the same conclusion it’s starting to look like the saying might well be true, that “God is still speaking.” And congratulations on that new bike of yours!
March 23rd, 2010 at 2:36 pm
Sarah–> Well, thanks to Lori for sending the girls this way
I’m so happy to read of your own journey of reconciliation and that it’s led to a deepening and evolving of your faith. Along with the struggles of such a journey there are so many blessings along the way, and having faith increased is one of the grandest! I’m not a great theologian with extensive research on the origins of heaven and hell in church history but that the threat of eternal damnation has been used to control people by the powers that be, seems all too apparent, both historically and today. You only have to throw a rock as far as the nearest queer person (not a far toss!) to know the reality of that, eh? Anyway, so glad you came by Sarah. Anytime, you’re welcome here !
March 23rd, 2010 at 2:49 pm
Rick–> Thanks SO much for your comments and for bringing Luke 9:51-56 to light. Despite the reading I’ve done on this topic in the past, I’ve yet to see this passage brought up as a consideration in this conversation. I did a quick look over your own website and appreciate your efforts to alleviate the fear and dread of hell that has tortured so many.
March 24th, 2010 at 9:25 pm
This is hard for me to read and agree in light of scripture. I know you are saying this is what you have come to believe… and I don’t argue the amazing love of God. I am one who is just getting to more peace with God as a loving Abba – who loves me as I am. I just don’t think we can skip His many other characteristics; like His righteous judgment, and the many examples of that in scripture. Would God be just if He didn’t judge righteously? I haven’t tried an exhaustive search, but what about some of the scriptures that come to mind right away… Here are two “red letter word” and examples –
Luke 13:
22Then Jesus went through the towns and villages, teaching as he made his way to Jerusalem. 23Someone asked him, “Lord, are only a few people going to be saved?”
He said to them, 24″Make every effort to enter through the narrow door, because many, I tell you, will try to enter and will not be able to. 25Once the owner of the house gets up and closes the door, you will stand outside knocking and pleading, ‘Sir, open the door for us.’
“But he will answer, ‘I don’t know you or where you come from.’
26″Then you will say, ‘We ate and drank with you, and you taught in our streets.’
27″But he will reply, ‘I don’t know you or where you come from. Away from me, all you evildoers!’
28″There will be weeping there, and gnashing of teeth, when you see Abraham, Isaac and Jacob and all the prophets in the kingdom of God, but you yourselves thrown out. 29People will come from east and west and north and south, and will take their places at the feast in the kingdom of God. 30Indeed there are those who are last who will be first, and first who will be last.”
AND
Luke 16:
22″The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham’s side. The rich man also died and was buried. 23In hell,[c] where he was in torment, he looked up and saw Abraham far away, with Lazarus by his side. 24So he called to him, ‘Father Abraham, have pity on me and send Lazarus to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, because I am in agony in this fire.’
25″But Abraham replied, ‘Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, while Lazarus received bad things, but now he is comforted here and you are in agony. 26And besides all this, between us and you a great chasm has been fixed, so that those who want to go from here to you cannot, nor can anyone cross over from there to us.’
These are examples of scripture that are part of the teaching I have always believed. I can deal with the clobber verses better than the thought of not hearing “well done good and faithful servant”, because that seems to tie into judgment and eternal destiny. Even the scriptures where Paul says that (make a list) won’t see the Kingdom of heaven, are indicative of a division of some kind, I still think our God is a righteous and loving judge. The saving blood of Christ is the key…the New Covenant..is the promise.
Maybe there are answers I don’t get yet. I appreciate your blogs every time … and the ministry of SisterFriends. Blessings
March 25th, 2010 at 7:39 am
You know I love this. Great post(s) Anita.
When I really and truly began truly understanding God as all loving and then began to look at our BEST human relationships…..the ones full of love, extreme patience, support, acceptance and all the other good things I began to realize that Gods character wasn’t opposite than that, it was that. And so if it was that, then how could all those other fear instilled ways or characteristics coincide with that?
I couldn’t just settle anymore with the answers we so frequently give….”God’s ways are not our ways”, “It’s not up to us to understand”, etc. I don’t think these apply here. It IS for us to understand. Especially when it comes to understanding the character of God and love.
I don’t think I really need to know if hell is an actual place or not. What I do need to know is more about the love God, what it means and how I can extend it. I want to grow in love, not in fear. Because I believe that by living in that love, I love in freedom as well.
Thanks for your great post(s) Anita.
March 25th, 2010 at 7:58 am
Funny wording in my last comment. Truly. LOL.
“I love in freedom as well” is suppose to read I live in freedom. But I guess this would apply too, eh?
March 25th, 2010 at 10:39 am
Seasons–> I’m on my phone so am not able to respond to your comments at this time. I only wanted you to know that I appreciate your perspective and your willingness to contribute it to the conversation. I’ll respond as soon as time and an accessible computer cross paths
March 25th, 2010 at 1:45 pm
Anita,
Im so glad you articulated how broad and encompassing God’s love can be, and especially, that as a thinking person, one might hold up their beliefs and align them with God, who is love.
Here is my quandary. There is no hell because of the abundance of God’s grace. But what about sin? No, It is not a sin for us to be gay, but where are the lines marking sinful-ness? Are there any?
My pastor, who is gay, and might have no truck with sin, believes sin is an important part of Christianity and a person’s relationship with God.
I personally banished the concept of sin when I came to the conclusion , as you did, there is no Hell because a God that gives love, would not allow it. Sin cannot be defined except in the broadest sense ( don’t kill, steal, covet, …) Yes, there are bounds to behavior, but sin leads to judgment It leads to guilt and shame. It gets used as a weapon to scare and force others to hurt others and themselves.
Where does sin fit with a conception of God who is love, who doesnt have a fiery furnace for sinners?
March 25th, 2010 at 2:17 pm
Renee–> I knew, and understandably so, that posting the idea that God doesn’t condemn anyone to eternal punishment would lead us to a whole range of questions….why then is there a need for Jesus? When then is the need for salvation? And as you asked, what about sin? I really do intend to respond to my thoughts on all this and would like to reserve them for an upcoming post. I don’t mean to leave you hanging out there with the question but I also want to know I have the time to give you and others a thoughtful and thought out reply. With a seder at church this evening and Holy Week starting up on Sunday, time is a little tight these days but I’ll make every effort to get another post up in a couple days. Thank you for your comment which will very much help me in framing my post
March 28th, 2010 at 9:23 am
I’m finding it hard to agree with this post. For as much as I believe in the limitless love, grace and mercy of God, I also believe in His holiness, justice, righteousness and judgements. As others have and will continue to ask, if there is no judgement, no hell–then why did Jesus Christ need to come, to live, die & triumph over death? And how is it just, loving, kind, etc. to incorporate those/people who in this life want nothing to do with God, deny, mock & blaspheme Him and do everything to obliterate Him by defiling, hurting, torturing, abusing physically, emotionally, even physically destroying/killing that which God deems most valuable above all else–human life? If human beings are deemed extremely valuable, then where would the justice be in requiring no punishment/judgement for extreme abuse/destruction of human life/lives? What’s the purpose of right & wrong? Morality? Values, honour, truth, doing what’s right, defending the helpless & vulnerable?
Can heaven really incorporate people like Saddam Hussein, a brutal tyrant who slaughtered and gassed more than a million of his own people? Or Hitler, or Yasir Arafat–a man who saught to wipe Israel off the map, who stole billions from his impoverished and desperate nation, to say that he “loved his people” is an affront to everything Jesus stood for, which was primarily a dedication to the oppressed, the poor, and the persecuted?
I know God’s love is BIG, and grace amazing……..but will He really bring those who want nothing to do with Him & His values into the ‘fold’….isn’t that against free will when those have distinctly refused God?
March 28th, 2010 at 11:32 am
Paperskater–>I have no problem with anyone disagreeing with me and I do appreciate that you and others in the comments are adding different perspectives. We all need to believe and act according to our own convictions and the ones I shared are mine…that’s all. As to the questions and issues you raised, I know they’re important ones to reconcile in some way with what I believe and I have for myself though not I’m sure in a way that might sit comfortably with someone else…and not in a way that has settled everything once and for all. These are the kinds of questions we spend our lives working out and the thing that concerns me most of all is if I or anyone would come to a place in their faith where they felt they had it all worked out and answered once and for all. I intend to follow up more on this post and at least touch on the questions you raised, hopefully this week. Again, I genuinely appreciate the questions you raised.
March 29th, 2010 at 10:38 am
my 2 cents’-worth (such as it is): I have to wonder if hell isn’t so much a place that we get condemned to as it might possibly be a place we choose for ourselves? In saying this, I’ve got C.S. Lewis’ “The Great Divorce” in mind – and though I realize it’s entirely a fantasy on the themes of heaven, hell, purgatory and eternal punishment, I think there is a lot of truth in it. (There are some biblical passages I could put in here, as a possible reference to the choice part of it, but am not at my regular ‘puter and am running a bit short on time…)
While I’m not in the place you are re. universalism (or whatever), I’m much, much closer to it than I’d ever dreamed I would be – if only because I cannot square the idea of a loving and merciful God with the terror evoked by so many regarding eternal punishment. (From the Middle Ages, with its terrifying paintings and sculptures of the damned, to Jonathan Edwards’ “Sinners in the Hands of an Angry God,” which is true horror writing, to… oh, I don’t know, am just rambling now!)
Perhaps things are more like Julian of Norwich’s translation of shalom …
“All shall be well, and all shall be well and all manner of thing shall be well.”
March 29th, 2010 at 10:43 am
oh, and…. seems interesting to me that there is no mention of eternal punishment in either the Apostles of Nicene Creeds. (Ba-bing! [or drum roll, or some other sound effect].)
There’s *gotta* be something to that, eh?
April 1st, 2010 at 3:30 am
wow, anita. you are really stuck on this ‘love of god’ thing, huh! ;0) so, the things you wrote above have got me really, really, really thinking. and i kind of agree with you. don’t get a big head about it. i might change my mind tomorrow.
this post makes me think of my friend’s little girl who said the other day, ‘people are mostly good and just a little bit bad.’ that makes so much sense to me and is why we all need jesus. and i think that, for the people who let that ‘little bit bad’ become evil and horrendous…well, those people are stuck with the wreakage of a life and afterlife (for a period of time if not eternity) that god cannot participate in. kind of like ‘natural consequences’ (to borrow from my parenting)? i don’t know…
thanks for the time and effort that went into this! i will reference it often.